(I apologize for the varying fonts in this post. I cannot get it to paste correctly).
Let me begin this dialogue with my friend Dr. Robert Pierce by saying that I hope you have read Robert’s comment in its entirety (see comment under "Evolution Weekend," Feb 14). Rob has some thought-provoking points that are worth considering, and if nothing else, it will give you a perspective from the side of a Darwinist who has put much thought into both sides of the creation/evolution debate. My plan is to respond to his various points in short segments over the following weeks, so stay tuned.
I have known Robert for about ten years now, and I believe him to be as honest as any man. I count it an honor to be his friend, and I am glad that our sons are friends as well. Interestingly enough, Rob and I have travelled similar paths through life, though we have ended up on opposite sides of a debate that has everything to do with origin, paths, and destination. Both of us grew up with a love for the game of hockey, and a love for wildlife. We both grew up east of the Mississippi and ended up in Idaho. We both majored in Wildlife Biology, receiving our Master’s degrees about the same year from sister universities a stone’s throw from one another—he at the University of Idaho in Moscow, Idaho, I at Washington State University eight miles away in Pullman, Washington. We both changed directions after receiving our Master’s, he only slightly to Veterinary School, I dramatically to preaching the gospel. We then both ended up in Sandpoint, Idaho, when our love for hockey brought us together for the first time ten years ago. Our sons have known each other from a very young age, and Robert and his wonderful wife Dawn have raised a fine young man whom we love to have in our home. As Robert says, it is ironic that our sons share so many common values, considering the different worldviews with which they were raised. If the evolution/creation debate has such moral implications (as I suggested in my Monday Morning Musings article that initiated this dialogue), to what do we attribute this ironic state of affairs? I will deal specifically with this question in a future blog. For now, let me briefly address the issue of worldview.
With such similar backgrounds, what accounts for the vastly different way that Rob and I view the world? Why do creationists see the theory of evolution as a ridiculous and absurd (and unscientific) explanation for the world around us and for our origins, while evolutionists see creationism as ignorant and unscientific superstition? In spite of claims made by anti-creationists, it cannot be that creationists are ignorant throwbacks to an alleged “flat-earth” mindset. There are thousands—and the number continues to grow—of highly educated scientists and engineers who believe the world was created by a supernatural Designer. Some of the greatest minds of our time, not to mention some of the greatest scientists in history, have been creationists (see http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-scientists.html for a short list). In fact, it can be easily shown that it was the Christian worldview (which includes the belief that the universe was created according to orderly laws) that gave rise to the true scientific method we so take for granted today. And as for scientists today, in 1979, Science Digest wrote:
"Scientists who utterly reject Evolution may be one of our fastest-growing controversial minorities… Many of the scientists supporting this position hold impressive credentials in science" (Larry Hatfield, "Educators Against Darwin," Science Digest Special (Winter 1979), pp. 94-96.; quoted in (http://www.christiananswers, ibid).
5 comments:
Well, Randy. You have a good start there. I can't wait for an evolutionary explanation of the bacterial flagellar motor. By the way...Which came first, the protein or the DNA molecule?
(I figured that was more fun than the chicken and the egg question)
Thanks to you Randy and also to your friend, Dr. Robert Pierce, for this discussion.
An old article, but a good one in Reader's Digest (March 1970) by David Raphael Klein pointed out that those who reject the concept of God may maintain good moral practices for a generation or two, but that ultimately the idea that there is no higher ethical standard than man leads to rebellion and moral anarchy in their children or grandchildren.
Thanks again,
Randy, you might like what's written on the following link. It's not particular to the discussion at hand *directly*, but it is a curious read:
http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science.shtml
It describes instances in the bible that explain scientific phenomena, which was written hundreds (and some, thousands) of years before it was discovered and/or documented.
-Mikael Skillings
That was a great post by Mikael Skillings. I will ask for forgiveness for pride. He's my son.
Thanks to Randy also for being a great mentor to him.
I believe Dr. Pierce is naive if he truly believes that "Opponents of evolution must understand that should someone discover ANYTHING that undermines the immense mountain of data upon which evolutionary 'truth' solidly rests, scientists will be the first to herald it's finding."
A new documentary by Ben Stein www.expelledthemovie.com will confirm for him some things that we on this side of the debate already knew.
Our intelligence is constantly being called into question. As soon as we can get past that, the dialog will be a much more intelligent one.
James Morris sent this by personal email, so I'm posting it for him:
Scientist are people too and come with their own biases and preconceived ideas - just as religious people do. Dogma bashing is on both side of the argument. I totally disagree with protestant theology and most people who bash Christians are really bashing Protestantism. Thus we find that truth is and always will be something you (individually) must search with some difficulty because some who say they found it are really just playing the philosophical systems game trusting that it will 'work' and meet all your needs. This is not faith, but walking in darkness.
Religion does not hold the key to morality, God does. It is only when we see how different we are from God do we even begin to understand our nature. While the nature can easily be exposed as 'evil' in society, we have never been able as a species to scientifically determine its cause and cure it. Why? Look at past attempts at socialism and you will find the idea that 'all are equal and some are more equal than others'. We reap what we sow and somehow always end up trying to find someone to do for us what we have the power to do for ourselves.
Holding 'truth' up to a vote of people has never produced very great results. Marx, Stalin, Pol Pot, various Pope, various Sultans, etc. seemed to have the will of the people on their side until another came to power.
'Truth' is a word which often carries with it the idea of what is best for me, but maybe not for you. Society plays a zero sum game where the only way for me to get ahead is for you to loose. Thus we always end up fighting to fulfill our personal needs rather than working together. Given our societies systems where people must earn a living - do you really want to start over because the truth you held dear was wrong?
In the end, I can say that the founding fathers probably had the biggest discussions about religion, morality and social responsibility. However, in today's world of right-wing global corporations replacing the power of government by the people and left-wing secularists thinking the answer to everything is socialism and the death or religion - common people find themselves trapped in a world where your life is mapped out in terms of how you can help a given side win. Neither answers the need of the people with science or religion. Thus it comes to the famous proverb - physician, heal yourself. While you can learn what to do, it does not mean you have the power to do it. That is why I am a Christian. I have free will, but with God's power life is better.
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